California Gov. Gavin Newsom said on Tuesday night on a popular liberal podcast that the U.S. should reconsider its military support for Israel, a marked evolution for a politician who traveled to Israel less than two weeks after the Oct. 7 terror attacks in 2023 and who said in an October interview that he would not consider eliminating U.S. military aid to Israel.

“Do you think, looking down the road, that the United States should consider maybe rethinking our military support for Israel?” Jon Favreau, the co-host of “Pod Save America,” asked Newsom during an event promoting the Democratic governor’s new book.

“It breaks my heart because the current leadership in Israel is walking us down that path where I don’t think you have a choice,” Newsom said in response. He also said in the conversation with Favreau and co-host Tommy Vietor, which came amid the joint U.S.-Israeli operation against Iran, that Israel could “appropriately” be described as an apartheid state. 

The “Pod Save” hosts have been some of the leading voices in the Democratic Party hostile to Israel and pro-Israel groups, boosting progressive primary candidates including Graham Platner in Maine and Abdul El-Sayed in Michigan, who made criticism of Israel central to their campaigns.

Further, Newsom seemed to make the argument that military support for Israel comes at the expense of social welfare programs in the U.S.

“To say this is in America’s interest at a time when affordability is at crisis levels, where you have an administration who literally got elected saying this is exactly the opposite of what they would ever consider doing, the fact that we are in this now regional war, all these proxies,” Newsom said, before trailing off into a conversation about corruption in the Trump administration.

On Thursday, Newsom will appear in Portsmouth, N.H., for another book talk — a location sure to raise eyebrows because of the state’s importance in the presidential primary contest. He’ll be interviewed by Jack Cocchiarella, a self-described “progressive political YouTuber” who also frequently bashes Israel. Cocchiarella said in a post on X promoting the event that they will be discussing Israel. Earlier this week, the podcast host called Israel “a terrorist state that threatens and kill [sic] Americans.” 

Izzy Gardon, a spokesperson for Newsom, told The New York Timeson Wednesday that he “believes in Israel’s right to exist — and its right to defend itself. Period.” 
Newsom “is calling out a difficult truth,” added Gardon, saying that President Donald Trump and Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu are “taking Israel down a course that threatens the safety of Israel — a democracy and America’s closest Middle East ally — as well as Israelis and American Jews.” Gardon declined to comment further to JI.

Newsom’s move away from military support for Israel is a shift even from his recent positions. In October, during an interview with the “Higher Learning” podcast, Newsom said he would not support ending U.S. military aid to Israel.

“No, I’m not prepared to say that I would support a blanket exemption for military support of Israel. That said, I’ve been very vocal in my opposition to Bibi Netanyahu,” said Newsom. 

He touted his decision in December 2023 to send humanitarian aid to Gaza, while also defending Israel’s right to exist.

“I am sitting here on your behalf, you’re a taxpayer,” Newsom said on the podcast, “as the only governor in the United States that sent a field hospital to Gaza and got it in through a third party country, and is disgusted by what’s happened in Gaza as a human being, as a father, who sees these children and how this war has been perpetuated by Bibi Netanyahu. I also have deep respect for the right of the State of Israel to exist and defend itself. And I thought the attack by Hamas was a terrorist attack, and we have to be clear about that as well.” 

Newsom is widely considered a 2028 presidential contender, and he has been shifting his public stances on Israel to the left in recent months in response to questions from progressive interviewers. 

In the days immediately after Oct. 7, Newsom lit the state capital in blue and white and unequivocally condemned Hamas’ actions. Less than two weeks later, he added a one-day visit to Israel onto a pre-planned trip to Asia. 

“Despite the horror, what I saw and heard from the people of Israel was a profound sense of resilience. A commitment to community and common purpose, especially in these most difficult of times,” Newsom said afterward. He first traveled to Israel in 2008, the first sitting mayor of San Francisco to do so, on a trip organized by the San Francisco Jewish Community Federation. 

Jewish allies of Newsom’s in California told Jewish Insider they disagreed with his choice of using the word “apartheid” but said his comments reflected sentiments familiar to those held by many pro-Israel Democrats who disagree with Netanyahu’s actions.

“I heard what he was saying as sort of a frustration, as, ‘I don’t want it to go there,’ but I’m hearing a lot of concerns and frustrations when he’s saying ‘it breaks my heart,’” said Andrew Lachman, a Culver City school board member and the former president of California Jewish Democrats.

Sam Lauter, a Democratic donor and activist in San Francisco, said he “would have preferred [Newsom] not use those words.”

“I don’t want the word apartheid to come up. I don’t want someone to position themselves as being open to the idea of cutting off military aid to Israel,” Lauter said. “I wouldn’t say that his position has changed or evolved. I think it’s just that the more that folks see Netanyahu and the Netanyahu government proceed down the path that they have proceeded down, the more you’re going to hear people say, this is where he’s put us.” 

During his October interview with the “Higher Learning” podcast, Newsom was asked to discuss his views on AIPAC after Van Lathan, the show’s host, said he would not vote for any candidate who accepted money from the pro-Israel lobby. At the time, Newsom appeared flummoxed and did not give a substantive answer.

“It’s interesting. I haven’t thought about AIPAC. And it’s interesting, you’re, like, the first to bring up AIPAC in years, which is interesting. It’s not relevant to my day to day life,” Newsom said.

Two months later, he was asked a similar question by Cocchiarella.

“I’ve never received a dollar from them in my entire political career. So that’s sort of absolute. So I’ve had an opinion on that going back decades now,” said Newsom. 

AIPAC only started spending in political races in 2022, and they have never donated to state candidates, only to congressional campaigns. But Newsom doubled down and compared AIPAC to other groups deemed politically toxic to Democrats.

“I don’t take tobacco money, oil money. I’ve never taken AIPAC money. I mean, there’s certain absolutes that are the lines that have been drawn for decades for me,” he said.

Lauter, who used to be involved with AIPAC and now sits on the board of Democratic Majority for Israel, called Newsom’s comments on AIPAC “immensely unfortunate.” 

“I’m disappointed that AIPAC has become such an easy target, even for folks that we should consider friends,” Lauter told JI on Wednesday.